RugbyRebels

Who do we want/need to see? Who needs to be kept safe?

Just reading Jim Hamilton’s article (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/9a1a ... 121e952493) and I think he has a point that a real forward slugathon might be just what we need. Can we adapt to that? We are also historically atrocious when we are favourites to win any game. I haven’t followed their progress but Rowntree seems suited to the raw materials he has in that squad, so it should be interesting.

Not totally convinced on Jim’s knowledge about back play but this bit caught my attention.

“In the centre, Chris Harris has made it all but certain he will go to Japan. Scotland have got plenty flash and dash: Ali Price when he’s at nine, Finn Russell, Stuart Hogg, Darcy Graham. Guys who can light up that field. But what they haven’t had is the defensive leader most teams have. The glue.

–– ADVERTISEMENT ––

Scotland need to establish a core of performers who will never be obvious standouts, who aren’t running in 50m tries or making massive hits out of the line, but understand the systems and are consistent in what they do. Everything points towards that with Harris. Assuming he gets over that ankle injury, Sam Johnson is likely to be inside Duncan Taylor for the opening match against Ireland. But as for the next cabs off the rank, Harris and Rory Hutchinson both have to be there for me. They are both guys who do the simple things well and make the game look easy by the way they read it. We all know the level Huw Jones set in the early part of his Scotland career, but he has fallen short of that standard for long enough to leave his selection in doubt.”

It’s hard to imagine not having Jones involved but can anyone actually remember his last impressive game?

I really have no idea who gets cut from 12 outwards. It’s amazing how few dead certs we have in that part of the field.

Anyone seen anything on Skinner, Thomson or Seymour? I read that Chib failed an HIA which, given he’s been out for 6 months with concussion, is potentially a very bad sign.

All the indications are that we will see close to a first choice side in Georgia. This makes sense: away fixture (boy do we need to start winning away), hot and humid, passionate atmosphere.

For me:

Reid (horses for courses - he is our best scrummaging prop. Georgian scrum will be fierce)
McInally
Nel (nailed on)
Gray (if fit)
Gilchrist (would have chosen skinner but think his WC is over - grade 2/3 hammy tear from the way he hobbled off)
Barclay (Ritchie on better form but need to see if Barclay can get back up to speed)
Watson
Wilson (Thomson if fit)
Laidlaw
Russell
Maitland
Johnson
Taylor
Graham (would still have Seymour as first choice but shouldn’t gamble with him even if he passes HIA tests)
Kinghorn (Hogg is the one player we need to wrap up)

Thoughts on the above...don’t particularly like the shape of the back row but in the absence of Thomson and Skinner we are more restricted.

Centres - if Johnson not fit then would like to see Hutchinson/Taylor or vv but think Harris may have jumped the queue a bit. Have never been impressed with him previously but he looked capable yesterday. Strong defensively and the line he picked for his try was intelligent. I was sitting in the North Stand and got a great view of the depth he came from, his timing and the angle picked.

All in all still not a great Test side. Lacking in world class and too much inexperience in certain positions. QF is base level but we’re not strong enough to win against SA or NZ unless we significantly outperform.

All sounds about right but I just don’t want to see that backrow again. Is Bradbury not fit? Is he gone already? I suppose Toonie would argue Wilson needs another run out but we know the limitations of that backrow.

I’ve not managed to see any of Hutchinson but I’d really like to see him get a start. I know everyone has been pining over Taylor since he’s been out but I don’t see how he is ahead. He’s barely even much more experienced than Hutchinson, and unquestionably hasn’t had any form to compare.

I like Taylor as a very versatile bench option but I think it’s more important to look at the others right now.

Really hope Johnson and Thomson are fit.

Hutchinson, the Fagersons, Bradbury and Berghan at LHP (if that is what is happening) all need a chance. Unless their selection or otherwise has been determined already.

Zander is guarenteed to go but needs a game.

I'm a bit confused by this centre position. For me, our first choice centres are still Johnson and Jones (or possibly Johnson and Taylor) and Harris isn't really in contention.

Johnson - a key player for me. Has good running, passing and defence and showed in 6N that he could step up.

Jones - not hit top form recently but don't understand half the criticism. He may be training badly for Glasgow but not really had enough games to say he is playing badly. As for Scotland, I'd say his last really good game was SA in the autumn but he has missed most games since then. The others haven't been shockers either and he had a few flashes last week.

Taylor - seems to have become a lot better by being unavailable as I never remember him being a nailed on starter before his injuries. At his best could provide a good all very round option and defence is meant to be good. Good experience in a winning team too. Wouldn't be too unhappy if he started at 13 but want to see more of him first.

Horne - Probably not deserving of all the stick he gets but I wouldn't take him. Too many glaring errors at what is meant to be his strength - handling. Does sometimes spark our backline but doesn't offer as much as the others for me. Covers 10 but not well enough that I wouldn't rather take a chance on someone else covering if needs be.

Hutchison - Only really seen highlights but together with reports they suggest he should be the fourth centre. Quick and defensively sharp apparently and has versatility and handling ability.

Harris - baffling that Jim Hamilton sees him as a nailed down solid option who "makes the game look easy by the way he reads it". He was solid on Saturday with one moment above that but has been very flaky in almost all his other appearances for Scotland. If he went, or at least if he started a game, we would be turning a position of strength and threat into a position of mediocrity.

I assume there will be a 4th centre but it’s still hard to see exactly how it breaks down.

Assuming the 31 is a 17/14 split.

17
Dell Reid/Bhatti
McInally Brown Turner/Stewart
Nel Berghan Fagerson
Gilchrist Toolis/Cummings
Gray Skinner (if fit)
Barclay Thomson (if fit)
Watson Ritchie
Wilson/Bradbury/Strauss/Fagerson

14
Price Laidlaw Horne
Russell Hastings
Seymour
Johnson Horne/Taylor
Jones
Maitland
Hogg Kinghorn

Leaving spots for two from for Horne/Taylor, Hutchinson, Harris, McGuigan, or Graham.

One think there would be 5 back rows rather than 6 especially if Skinner makes it as a second row

There will be 5 props that go.
Think it'll be 8 front row, 4 second rows and 5 back rows.

Cameo, the staff love Harris and Big Jim knows that so trying to look clever.

So a 16/15 split? I would have thought you’d want another forward but maybe.

Who do you pick for 5 backrows and 4 centres?

I like how you made a new thread for the Georgia game and it deviated into a "who are we taking to the RWC" topic for which we already have a thread.

CHAOS.

I'd go with:
Dell
Brown (if fit)/McInally
ZFagerson
Gray (if fit)
GG
Bradbury
Watson
Fagerson

Laidlaw
Russell
Graham
Taylor
Hutchinson
Maitland
Kinghorn

McInally/Stewart, Berghan, Nel, Cummings, Wilson, Horne Jnr, Hastings, Harris

I do think it would be preferable for the "1s" to get a run out but want to see the guys who haven't started yet. I also want to get Russell game time away from home when things may not go well rather than just slotting him in at home.

hugh_woatmeigh wrote:I like how you made a new thread for the Georgia game and it deviated into a "who are we taking to the RWC" topic for which we already have a thread.

CHAOS.

What can I say. I live life on the edge.

It did all kind of blur into one, but yeah the key thing is who needs this last chance v Georgia.

I like Big D’s team.

Mikey Brown wrote:So a 16/15 split? I would have thought you’d want another forward but maybe.

Who do you pick for 5 backrows and 4 centres?

Think that is 17/14 no?

Back row is tough but I would say Watson, Barclay, Thompson, Bradbury and Fagerson/Ritchie.

My centres would be Johnson, Jones, Taylor and Hutchison although I can just about see an argument for Horne

Cameo wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:So a 16/15 split? I would have thought you’d want another forward but maybe.

Who do you pick for 5 backrows and 4 centres?

Think that is 17/14 no?

Back row is tough but I would say Watson, Barclay, Thompson, Bradbury and Fagerson/Ritchie.

My centres would be Johnson, Jones, Taylor and Hutchison although I can just about see an argument for Horne

Yep. I just can't count, it seems. I thought 17 allowed for 6 backrows but no. Wilson will go, regardless of any other factors, which makes it really tough.

Ritchie was possibly our most consistent player last season. It seems insane to leave him out but Watson is better at 7 and I'm not sure he offers the physicality we need at 6 or 8 (to make up for other deficiencies).

Horne I'm equally stuck on. He's been at the heart of so many good things for Scotland but just never seems to quite iron out the errors. Still slightly baffled at how nailed on Taylor appears to be but I guess he is also super versatile.

Mikey Brown wrote: Ritchie was possibly our most consistent player last season. It seems insane to leave him out but Watson is better at 7 and I'm not sure he offers the physicality we need at 6 or 8 (to make up for other deficiencies).

I am just going to put this out there. Right now I think he is a better rugby player than Barclay. Not counting any leadership type stuff.

I think I struggle with the idea of letting go of Barclay when he was so good coming back into the side and taking on the captaincy, but you might be right. I know he had one storming game since coming back from injury but I don't really know what level he's at right now as a player. I'd still have him ahead of Wilson in any backrow position though.

Mikey Brown wrote:I think I struggle with the idea of letting go of Barclay when he was so good coming back into the side and taking on the captaincy, but you might be right. I know he had one storming game since coming back from injury but I don't really know what level he's at right now as a player. I'd still have him ahead of Wilson in any backrow position though.

Barclay looked off the pace in the first game against France, but so did everyone else and I also think that part of that was due to a whack he got on the head from that French lad who later picked up a suspension for his troubles. I reckon Barclay will start in Tbilisi.

Also, what I am pleased about is that it feels that for this squad, we’re more worried about who is going to get left out whereas in previous squads it felt like a lot of the talking points were about who was going to go as squad filler!

Looks like 2 of Graham/ Kinghorn/ Seymour, and we’ll probably be leaving out a couple of good centres, back rowers and locks.

Good point. I wish that could be said of the front row choices but we are where we are. Seems so odd that Reid is looking like going after the last couple of seasons.

It's a shame if either Graham or Kinghorn end up missing out as they are two of our most exciting attackers. I can't see Seymour missing out but he doesn't seem to have recently hit the heights of the last few years either.

Skinner ruled out of the RWC. Shit.

No, I don't know why I created this extra thread.

Yes, I know it's just me, alone, on this board talking to myself.

An opportunity to call up TTRI?

Oh for fucks sake.

Mikey Brown wrote:Oh for fucks sake.

Yeah. Really don't get that at all.

Okay, just seen Swinson's in as "training cover", so I guess the 2nd row's fixed, and no point bringing TTRI over from France just to hold a tackle bag.

no sleep wrote:Okay, just seen Swinson's in as "training cover", so I guess the 2nd row's fixed, and no point bringing TTRI over from France just to hold a tackle bag.

And he said no.

Big D wrote:

no sleep wrote:Okay, just seen Swinson's in as "training cover", so I guess the 2nd row's fixed, and no point bringing TTRI over from France just to hold a tackle bag.

And he said no.

Source?