League "World" Cup

[morepork]

Good quote. I missed it first time around.

Kiwis can muscle up with their pack, but England and Oz can negate this, with the Roos having insane pace and guile out wide to kill it off. Johnson is our only really dangerous pivot, but if he can follow up the offloads from Asofa-Solomona and his mates, Dean Whare and good old dependable Jason Nightingale might make hay. Hooker is a vital one for the Kiwis, and I hope Leuluai can be interchanged effectively to link our big boys with the backs for the full 80.

[rowan]

I think if rugby union wanted to promote its game in PNG the best start would be an annual international 7s tournament in Port Moresby. There would be a ready-made audience for that, because in the abbreviated code there really is very little difference between union and league. Also, it's something they might achieve success at in the fairly short term. Developing PNG as a force in the XV man code would follow, of course, but would definitely have to be a long term objective.

[kk67]

Like Toulon,....I'd be interested in visiting Port Moresby for a rugby fest'.

[morepork]

Union is on a hiding to nothing in PNG. They love their league. National sport no less.

[rowan]

Indeed. Exactly why I was talking about 7s. I see they picked up a couple of wins at the Oceania 7s today and also gave the Samoans a reasonable game. They're built for the game and could adapt quickly, especially those who have already developed the basis skills through league.

[morepork]

There is a reasonable argument to that effect, but can it compete with the enthusiasm of the locals for the Kumils? Seems a square peg for a round hole.

[rowan]

There is a reasonable argument to that effect, but can it compete with the enthusiasm of the locals for the Kumils? Seems a square peg for a round hole.

No, and that wouldn't be the aim. But PNG has a population of 8 million and it is conceivable that with a little hard work - and using 7s as the vehicle - the Pukpuks might one day be good enough to compete with the Pacific Islands and provide players of Super Rugby quality and so forth. Of course, they'll probably never challenge the Kumuls, just as the Kiwis are unlikely to ever usurp the All Blacks, but that's not the point.

[morepork]

There is a reasonable argument to that effect, but can it compete with the enthusiasm of the locals for the Kumils? Seems a square peg for a round hole.

No, and that wouldn't be the aim. But PNG has a population of 8 million and it is conceivable that with a little hard - and using 7s as the vehicle - the Pukpuks might one day be good enough to compete with the Pacific Islands and provide players of Super Rugby quality and so forth. Of course, they'll probably never challenge the Kumuls, just as the Kiwis are unlikely to ever usurp the All Blacks, but that's not the point.

You need to look at the community behind loyalty to a particular code. The Kiwis will never usurp the ABs in NZ as a national point of focus, but the league community in places like South Auckland, some parts of Canterbury, Wellington, and the West Coast, is rooted deep. Parts of the North of England have a similar family. I'll concede that league has nothing like the national fervour union has on the international levels, but you will never replace the reverence communities have for the Ruben Wikis and Olsen Filipainas of the code, despite them plying their trade overseas at club level. I mentioned the Ropatis in Mangare on another thread. Those guys are completely part of the fabric of where they are from and the fact they aren't union boys is, whatever you may think of it, part of their identity in the communities they come from.

[rowan]

Sure, and eventually you'd want to establish something similar with the rugby union community in PNG, attracting players into the game through 7s. According to World Rugby stats they currently only have 3200 reg. players which is comparable to, say, Sweden, but they have a further 20 K unregistered players, which is more in line with Romania. So the players are certainly there. They just need to get them involved officially.

[morepork]

Sure, and eventually you'd want to establish something similar with the rugby union community in PNG, attracting players into the game through 7s. According to World Rugby stats they currently only have 3200 reg. players which is comparable to, say, Sweden, but they have a further 20 K unregistered players, which is more in line with Romania. So the players are certainly there. They just need to get them involved officially.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

[Spy]

Tonga on fire in Hamilton. 22 unanswered second half points to lead NZ 24-16, 15 to play.

[Spy]

Great second half for Tonga. Absolute scenes. That's put a stray dog in the chookhouse.

[rowan]

Tonga, population 100 K, beat the Kiwis? Or should I say, peewees!!

Nice to see an upset, but that really does put this mickey mouse parade into perspective.

[morepork]

Fuck off cunt.

[rowan]

Tonga, population 100 K, beat the Kiwis? Or should I say, peewees!!

Nice to see an upset, but that really does put this mickey mouse parade into perspective.

Still laughing about this one! There's more people in my neighborhood than their are in Tonga. Maybe we could throw together a league team & whoop the Peewees too

[J Dory]

Pretty cool for Tonga, could see how much it meant to them, fully deserved the win. Not sure what to read into this for the kiwis, hopefully they can bounce back.

[rowan]

Pretty cool for Tonga, could see how much it meant to them, fully deserved the win. Not sure what to read into this for the kiwis, hopefully they can bounce back.

Q: What's red, black and white all over?

A: Kiwis having their bums spanked by Tonga

[morepork]

Pretty cool for Tonga, could see how much it meant to them, fully deserved the win. Not sure what to read into this for the kiwis, hopefully they can bounce back.

It was a great game. Both sides attacked, crowd was insane, and respeck shown by both sides. Kiwis have come out fully backing dual eligibility for Pacific Island teams.

You'd think that combination of things in a tournament upset would be a positive point of focus for commentary.

[J Dory]

Pretty cool for Tonga, could see how much it meant to them, fully deserved the win. Not sure what to read into this for the kiwis, hopefully they can bounce back.

Q: What's red, black and white all over?

A: Kiwis having their bums spanked by Tonga [emoji38] [emoji38] [emoji38]

You really are desperate for attention, puja was right, it's sad.

[rowan]

Do we have a league version of Lizard around to tell us if that Tonga win was the biggest upset in Rugby League World Cup history? Has there even been a major upset in World Cup history before? I don't recall any. & has anyone besides NZ & Britain ever beaten the Roos?

[morepork]

The USA very nearly beat them in Philly in 2004. France is an original League power, having series wins over Australia in 1951, 1955, 1967 and 1978. I'll leave it to a French resident to detail the issues with French rugby league since 1933.It wasn't until 1954 that the tournament really got recognised and made official. The final that year was played between the UK and France, with the UK getting in. The next tourney was in Australia in 1957, which Australia won, but the UK France play off drew 50 000+. The Kiwis winning the cup in 2008 was a big upset. The Roos and Kiwis had some titanic battles with UK club sides in the '70 on tours.

[rowan]

The USA very nearly beat them in Philly in 2004. France is an original League power, having series wins over Australia in 1951, 1955, 1967 and 1978. I'll leave it to a French resident to detail the issues with French rugby league since 1933.It wasn't until 1954 that the tournament really got recognised and made official. The final that year was played between the UK and France, with the UK getting in. The next tourney was in Australia in 1957, which Australia won, but the UK France play off drew 50 000+. The Kiwis winning the cup in 2008 was a big upset. The Roos and Kiwis had some titanic battles with UK club sides in the '70 on tours.

Thanks. So from that I deduce the Tongan win over NZ probably was the biggest upset in RLWC history, and that the only teams to have ever beaten the Roos are NZ, Britain and France. I didn't know France were ever that strong in league, though I do recall them defeating the Kiwis in NZ in a very controversial series in the 1990s (Gary Freeman blamed the refs, who were also French, weirdly). Rugby-a-treize only took off south of the Channel after the French rugby union team were banned from the 5 Nations in the 1930s due to professionalism. But they, Les Bleus, returned after WWII and actually became the first nation to win a series in SA in the 20th century. Since then league has taken a back seat, as far as I know. Meanwhile, I can't imagine how the USA (beaten 64-0 by PNG this weekend) could nearly have been the Roos, given they are selected from just a few thousand players. That would be sort of like Finland almost beating the All Blacks

[morepork]

The USA very nearly beat them in Philly in 2004. France is an original League power, having series wins over Australia in 1951, 1955, 1967 and 1978. I'll leave it to a French resident to detail the issues with French rugby league since 1933.It wasn't until 1954 that the tournament really got recognised and made official. The final that year was played between the UK and France, with the UK getting in. The next tourney was in Australia in 1957, which Australia won, but the UK France play off drew 50 000+. The Kiwis winning the cup in 2008 was a big upset. The Roos and Kiwis had some titanic battles with UK club sides in the '70 on tours.

Thanks. So from that I deduce the Tongan win over NZ probably was the biggest upset in RLWC history, and that the only teams to have ever beaten the Roos are NZ, Britain and France. I didn't know France were ever that strong in league, though I do recall them defeating the Kiwis in NZ in a very controversial series in the 1990s (Gary Freeman blamed the refs, who were also French, weirdly). Rugby-a-treize only took off south of the Channel after the French rugby union team were banned from the 5 Nations in the 1930s due to professionalism. But they, Les Bleus, returned after WWII and actually became the first nation to win a series in SA in the 20th century. Since then league has taken a back seat, as far as I know. Meanwhile, I can't imagine how the USA (beaten 64-0 by PNG this weekend) could nearly have been the Roos, given they are selected from just a few thousand players. That would be sort of like Finland almost beating the All Blacks

I went to the Roos USA game in 2004. I think the Australians were hungover. The crowd were rabid.I was also at the Auckland Roos game at Carlaw Park when Auckland won 26-24.Railway stand at Carlaw with a pie....good memories.

[rowan]

Meanwhile, I can't imagine how the USA (beaten 64-0 by PNG this weekend) could nearly have been the Roos, given they are selected from just a few thousand players. That would be sort of like Finland almost beating the All Blacks

Sorry, Sweden would have been a more apt comparison there. Finland only has a few hundred players.

I went to the Roos USA game in 2004. I think the Australians were hungover. The crowd were rabid.I was also at the Auckland Roos game at Carlaw Park when Auckland won 26-24.Railway stand at Carlaw with a pie....good memories.

The latter was during the 1989 tour, I believe. I also watched the Roos play that year in a 10-28 win over Wellington at the Basin Reserve (the last time they ever played a non-test, I believe). It was the only rugby league match involving an international side that I ever saw live, in fact. I've never seen the Kiwis except on TV. Sonny Whakarau scored one of the home-team's two tries and danced around afterward giving the Aussies the fingers. I Iater became acquainted with the guy during my journalism days

[morepork]

Yes, 1988. Got tickets through my club. The Aussies have been very gracious in giving up home games for tests to be played in NZ over the years.