RugbyRebels

Mikey Brown wrote:I can’t say I’ve watched Kinghorns defence too closely when out on the wing but my feeling was he instantly looked more comfortable there in previous appearances than I’d ever seen him in defence at 15.

Being a good or bad defender on the wing seems to be much more about intuition in positioning than tackling skill. I’m not sure he’d ever even played wing for Edinburgh at the point he first did for Scotland?

Is it Townsend or Tandy who made that statement? Was it in reference to him playing a specific position?

Townsend when talking about him in general in the Autumn.

Fair enough. Seems kind of meaningless when you're talking about a player who could be at 10, 15 or wing though. You don't exactly picture him as a destructive tackler. Mentioning his size also seems strange as he really doesn't use it in either attack or defence.

What I did enjoy in the highlights from the Connacht game was seeing him actually run on to the ball. I'm not attempting to judge his quality as an international prospect at 10 from a 5 minute highlights video of a rampant club victory, but he does have something about him in attack. I don't know if our attack is simply setup to stutter, or they all stand so deep to leave themselves options, but it feels like we never get players actually running on to the ball.

Mikey Brown wrote:I can’t say I’ve watched Kinghorns defence too closely when out on the wing but my feeling was he instantly looked more comfortable there in previous appearances than I’d ever seen him in defence at 15.

Being a good or bad defender on the wing seems to be much more about intuition in positioning than tackling skill. I’m not sure he’d ever even played wing for Edinburgh at the point he first did for Scotland?

Is it Townsend or Tandy who made that statement? Was it in reference to him playing a specific position?

Kinghorn's defence has IMHO historically been better on the wing than full back, but in both cases he can be caught badly out of position, especially full back, Which is amazing given that is where he has played most of his career. If we look at him as a 10, he is much more likely to be hidden on opposition set piece ball than Russell or Hastings, despite being 6" taller and probably 15Kg+ heavier. He really does not like guys running straight at him

Cameo wrote:

septic 9 wrote:we had the best squad and best depth ever. Anyone who said or thought that needs to remember it. And not repeat it. Fullish squad wasn't too great, and we are always, always picking from a shallow pool

I probably said that and I'd repeat it. We would have been very happy with Blair Kinghorn and Steyn as our first choice wings not that long ago, let alone as options to come in. We have a shallow pool compared to others, but for Scotland it is historically great.

The two areas that are looking a bit shallower than sometimes are 9 (lots of meh options behind Price) and back row (where all three of our starters got injured and we (rightly) still haven't called up people like Gary Graham or Ryan Wilson).

everyone improves. Relative to others, we I think have improved, even if results say its not a huge gain. Depth has always been a problem, still is, in every position. Some positions are very think, others 2 injuries away from what-are-we-gonna-do-now?
And some of the depth, as you say can be poor. I'd take issue with Wilson in his prime, but he is not there now. Gary Graham never was

Thistle pod suggesting Matt Fagerson, Johnson and Russell will all start.

Big D wrote:Thistle pod suggesting Matt Fagerson, Johnson and Russell will all start.

Fantastic news if Fagerson is fully fit again.

Johnson looked quite lively in the Scarlets game, albeit in a thoroughly beaten side. I had completely forgotten about the existence of Chib Thompson. I was never really sure if he just didn't look up to it as a player, was too injury prone, or just didn't really have enough time to settle in. I think a lot of us were hoping he'd be a big ball carrying option at 8 but was really more of a rangey, jumping 6.

Darge will need his jumping boots as the alternative 4th option.

Tuipolotu on the bench makes no sense at all, so far he has shown he can run staright and thats about it at international level. Shame for Bennett to be dropped as he looked decent v France.

Also wonder if Hastings is there in part to baby sit Vellacott who has yet to show much if any game control for Edinburgh.

What the fuck? I really assumed Bennet would be in. How can he have been worth a bench spot last time, perform that well, and then not be worth a place in the 23.

Backrow balance will be interesting, not sure how keen I am on that but I guess GT is worried about getting outdone at the breakdown? Wilson was saying on the podcast that Darge has basically never jumped in the lineout, and I’m not sure Fagerson is a fantastic option there either?

Kinghorn dropped completely. What is he meant to do? He’s been asked to learn 10 on the job at international level and now can’t make the squad against Italy. Hastings is obviously the better flyhalf cover, but how does GT paint himself in to these corners?

Kinghorn unavailable. Makes sense now they brought two 10s into the squad and Finn was absent last week for Racing too.

Mikey Brown wrote:
Backrow balance will be interesting, not sure how keen I am on that but I guess GT is worried about getting outdone at the breakdown? Wilson was saying on the podcast that Darge has basically never jumped in the lineout, and I’m not sure Fagerson is a fantastic option there either?

Doesn't want to drop Watson.

What pod is Wilson on?

The Ryan Wilson Rugby Podcast starring Ryan Wilson.

Offload or something? A rugby pass one. They largely just make him talk about who should be at 10 for England but he’s pretty entertaining on it.

Imagine if Darcy goes down. Do we go ST at 13 and Harris on the wing? That would probably the slowest backline ever to take the field.

I would have quite liked Watson on the bench. Let the new guy show what he’s got in his proper position and see that he has to fight for the 7 shirt.

Mikey Brown wrote:The Ryan Wilson Rugby Podcast starring Ryan Wilson.

Offload or something? A rugby pass one. They largely just make him talk about who should be at 10 for England but he’s pretty entertaining on it.

Imagine if Darcy goes down. Do we go ST at 13 and Harris on the wing? That would probably the slowest backline ever to take the field.

I would have quite liked Watson on the bench. Let the new guy show what he’s got in his proper position and see that he has to fight for the 7 shirt.

Hastings to full back and Hogg to the wing? Or maybe Velacott could do a few minutes there? We're missing a trick by not utilising Steyns versatility and having a back 3 option on the bench, though I agree that Bennett is hard done by. Problem is that there's no Dave Cherry.

Quite a mobile pack. Hope we really look to move the ball and tire the Italians. Got to build a score though, can't give them hope.

There's a part of me that still firmly believes Cherry is the most dependable hooker we have, just isn't as good around the park.

Since Tandy has come in this is the 1st 6N game v Italy Jones hasn't started.

Maybe Watson and Darge should play left and right rather than open side and blind side?

I like the pack but bit disappointed about the backs - well, basically, by the centres. I just really want to move on from Harris and Bennett gave me some hope.

One thing, though, I think Steyn will really impress some people who don't pay much attention to club rugby.

Big D wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:
Backrow balance will be interesting, not sure how keen I am on that but I guess GT is worried about getting outdone at the breakdown? Wilson was saying on the podcast that Darge has basically never jumped in the lineout, and I’m not sure Fagerson is a fantastic option there either?

Doesn't want to drop Watson.

What pod is Wilson on?

Here you go :

He used to share it with Zeebo.

Adder wrote:

Big D wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:
Backrow balance will be interesting, not sure how keen I am on that but I guess GT is worried about getting outdone at the breakdown? Wilson was saying on the podcast that Darge has basically never jumped in the lineout, and I’m not sure Fagerson is a fantastic option there either?

Doesn't want to drop Watson.

What pod is Wilson on?

Here you go :

He used to share it with Zeebo.

Ta

Cameo wrote:I like the pack but bit disappointed about the backs - well, basically, by the centres. I just really want to move on from Harris and Bennett gave me some hope.

One thing, though, I think Steyn will really impress some people who don't pay much attention to club rugby.

Agreed.
Even allowing for this weekends opposition Harris keeps us firmly in the 17-23 point bracket attacking-wise in my view. All Italy need are a couple of penalties and our usual dodgy/soft donation try and it's an arm wrestle.

The one thing pretty much everyone agrees on is the attack hasn't functioned this championship. In fact, it has gone backwards since the last world cup. Price, Russell and Hogg where there before and still there now so what else has changed?
Folk point to the measurable improvement in defence and that's undeniably the case. However points scored win games every bit as much as points not conceded. We still concede points but score less and being on the wrong side of a ref or 50/50 game is a national speciality.

So how is this shift from one extreme philosophy to the other considered an improvement?

af73 wrote:

Cameo wrote:I like the pack but bit disappointed about the backs - well, basically, by the centres. I just really want to move on from Harris and Bennett gave me some hope.

One thing, though, I think Steyn will really impress some people who don't pay much attention to club rugby.

Agreed.
Even allowing for this weekends opposition Harris keeps us firmly in the 17-23 point bracket attacking-wise in my view. All Italy need are a couple of penalties and our usual dodgy/soft donation try and it's an arm wrestle.

The one thing pretty much everyone agrees on is the attack hasn't functioned this championship. In fact, it has gone backwards since the last world cup. Price, Russell and Hogg where there before and still there now so what else has changed?
Folk point to the measurable improvement in defence and that's undeniably the case. However points scored win games every bit as much as points not conceded. We still concede points but score less and being on the wrong side of a ref or 50/50 game is a national speciality.

So how is this shift from one extreme philosophy to the other considered an improvement?

The attack coach keeps changing. I liked O'Halloran and Blair is showing his skills with Edinburgh at the minute. I'm not really seeing it with Zondagh at the minute, though it's early days. We seem to have gone from having options for Russel to pick from in attack to something much more proscribed, safer but more predictable and with less disguise. Hopefully it's just a case of him needing more time to implement more sophisticated attacking patterns

Italian team is out. Braley instead of Varney is good for us I think. I've been impressed with Ruzza so far.

Italy XV: Padovani; Bruno, Brex, Marin, Ioane; Garbisi, Braley; Fischetti, Nicotera, Ceccarelli, Cannone, Ruzza, Pettinelli, Lamaro, Halafihi

Replacements: Bigi, Nemer, Zilocchi, Sisi, Zuliani, Fusco, Zanon, Capuozzo

switchskier wrote:

af73 wrote:

Cameo wrote:I like the pack but bit disappointed about the backs - well, basically, by the centres. I just really want to move on from Harris and Bennett gave me some hope.

One thing, though, I think Steyn will really impress some people who don't pay much attention to club rugby.

Agreed.
Even allowing for this weekends opposition Harris keeps us firmly in the 17-23 point bracket attacking-wise in my view. All Italy need are a couple of penalties and our usual dodgy/soft donation try and it's an arm wrestle.

The one thing pretty much everyone agrees on is the attack hasn't functioned this championship. In fact, it has gone backwards since the last world cup. Price, Russell and Hogg where there before and still there now so what else has changed?
Folk point to the measurable improvement in defence and that's undeniably the case. However points scored win games every bit as much as points not conceded. We still concede points but score less and being on the wrong side of a ref or 50/50 game is a national speciality.

So how is this shift from one extreme philosophy to the other considered an improvement?

The attack coach keeps changing. I liked O'Halloran and Blair is showing his skills with Edinburgh at the minute. I'm not really seeing it with Zondagh at the minute, though it's early days. We seem to have gone from having options for Russel to pick from in attack to something much more proscribed, safer but more predictable and with less disguise. Hopefully it's just a case of him needing more time to implement more sophisticated attacking patterns

Yeah, players talked about having to learn a complicated playbook when they went to Scotland camps. Now it doesn't seem we have many moves. Our plan now seems just to be to go through phases with runners off 9 or 10 and then, if some space opens up, fire it wide to Hogg as quickly as possible.

FFS that's three times at the ruck already. We're going to lose to fucking Italy

switchskier wrote:FFS that's three times at the ruck already. We're going to lose to fucking Italy

Was just thinking exactly that but that's a high quality try, end to end and side to side. That's what we can do. Now it'll be back to the shite for another 10 minutes.

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Jesus

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