RugbyRebels

Never in doubt...JR indeed shows his maturity in performance & reaction.Big contribution too from Foakes.
New management/leadership set up will be most chuffed.
Eng. winning at Lords is such a rarity these days - maybe they can make it T1 as a fixture!.

Big win completed with something to spare in the end. Great moment for Root who steered us home impressively.

Galfon wrote:Never in doubt...JR indeed shows his maturity in performance & reaction.Big contribution too from Foakes.
New management/leadership set up will be most chuffed.
Eng. winning at Lords is such a rarity these days - maybe they can make it T1 as a fixture!.

yep, should have mentioned Foakes. Huge difference in confidence behind the stumps and a stabilising presence at 7 in a way that Buttler for all his great shotmaking never really was, hard as he tried. Trouble is, we still have very long tail and no top 3

Galfon wrote:Never in doubt...JR indeed shows his maturity in performance & reaction.Big contribution too from Foakes.
New management/leadership set up will be most chuffed.
Eng. winning at Lords is such a rarity these days - maybe they can make it T1 as a fixture!.

It's good to have a win finally, but I don't know there's a huge amount to be cheerful about - England's batting performance being almost entirely reliant on Root and Stokes making runs isn't exactly news or progress. Better than a loss, but the same problems remain with the rest of the lineup, with no-one really putting their hands up to be a solution, one innings from Foakes alongside Root notwitstanding.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Galfon wrote:Never in doubt...JR indeed shows his maturity in performance & reaction.Big contribution too from Foakes.
New management/leadership set up will be most chuffed.
Eng. winning at Lords is such a rarity these days - maybe they can make it T1 as a fixture!.

It's good to have a win finally, but I don't know there's a huge amount to be cheerful about - England's batting performance being almost entirely reliant on Root and Stokes making runs isn't exactly news or progress. Better than a loss, but the same problems remain with the rest of the lineup, with no-one really putting their hands up to be a solution, one innings from Foakes alongside Root notwitstanding.

Puja

Well it cheered me up to see Root and Foakes play so well in a difficult run chase, and especially a personal triumph for the thoroughly top chap that Root is; 10000 test runs is quite a feat with more to come.

As I said above, the problems that were there before the test are still there, but happy to be happy in the moment for Root.

I thought both openers looked good for a time...before getting out stupidly. Crawley really should be learning by now, but Lees can be given some leeway. Pope an international 3? Nah. I totally get Bairstow in the team as a fielder, he's excellent, but his batting is so hit and miss, and that's exactly what we don't need more of.

Hard not to feel that Potts is another of the long line of English condition friendly bowlers who will burst onto the scene at home and peter out away...

Another promising batting display - albeit on a helpful track and with an opposition who are determined to give second chances to the batsmen. I don't know if this proves much about their inherent quality, just the same as the first test didn't, but the confidence boost is going to make a huge difference to some of these English batsmen. It had to be demoralising to keep going out continually expecting your teammates to collapse and you to join them and this fillip will hopefully give them the breathing space to improve their game in a much lower pressure environment.

Puja

29 runs in the first 4 overs of the day. Bright start then!

ETA. I went too early - 43 runs in 5 overs! New Zealand's bowling attack are just broken this morning.

ETETA. Literally as I type that, Root loses his wicket. Bugger. Well, it was fun while it lasted, but I think that might be the end of the hopes of a big first innings lead. Fully expect Broad to be two 4s and out and the rest of our long tail to fold gently to see us to parity or just under. Which we would absolutely have taken at the start of the innings, mind.

Foakes has played well. He's done the attacking verve; let's see how he does with being the senior partner and shepherding the tail.

Puja

Stuart Broad out for 9 after 2 boundaries. Wish I could say I was a prophet, but I feel it'd be cheating to claim that as a mystical prediction. He's just not a good enough batsman to play as high as number 8 - he might've been able to get there at one point, but at this stage in his career, he doesn't seem wiling to do anything other than swish, swish, edge, bye and that's number 10 or 11 behaviour.

Puja

43 runs in 5 overs, then 23 runs for 5 after the first wicket fell. That tail is just too long.

Still, we'd've taken someone's hand off at the wrist to still be playing on Day 4 after NZ made 553 in their first innings, let alone only 16 behind. Needs a massive effort from the bowlers if we're going to get something out of this game - the last thing we need is NZ to rattle up a quick 200+ and have a day to bowl at us under cloudy skies.

Puja

6 out all out w broad at 8

Puja wrote:Stuart Broad out for 9 after 2 boundaries. Wish I could say I was a prophet, but I feel it'd be cheating to claim that as a mystical prediction. He's just not a good enough batsman to play as high as number 8 - he might've been able to get there at one point, but at this stage in his career, he doesn't seem wiling to do anything other than swish, swish, edge, bye and that's number 10 or 11 behaviour.

Puja

broad took a bad knock on the head (2014?)- was averaging 28 at that point- and has clearly not fancied facing test pace since. Shame as he has batting talent, but 8 is at least 4 places too high

still has nearly 3500 runs and 540 wickets which is decent

I'm starting to wonder about Leach...I mean, I thought he was OKish before, but now I'm starting to think he's actually pretty poor.

Maybe I simply misremember, it was a long time ago, but the King of Spain was better than this, wasn't he?

But who the hell is there? Parkinson looked OKish first test.

Stom wrote:I'm starting to wonder about Leach...I mean, I thought he was OKish before, but now I'm starting to think he's actually pretty poor.

Maybe I simply misremember, it was a long time ago, but the King of Spain was better than this, wasn't he?

But who the hell is there? Parkinson looked OKish first test.

I think Giles was quite badly underrated, tbh. Suffered by being in an era of truly great spin bowlers like Warne and Muralitharan, and the comparisons were never going to be kind, but he did a decent job with what he had, probably better than he deserved to based just on his natural talent. He was a hell of a lot better than any of our current spin options.

Maybe it's worthwhile accepting that we just don't have a spinner that's worth our time currently and look at another seamer? Or hells, get Moeen back - at least he'd reduce the tail and mostly hold down an end.

Puja

Banquo wrote:

Puja wrote:Stuart Broad out for 9 after 2 boundaries. Wish I could say I was a prophet, but I feel it'd be cheating to claim that as a mystical prediction. He's just not a good enough batsman to play as high as number 8 - he might've been able to get there at one point, but at this stage in his career, he doesn't seem wiling to do anything other than swish, swish, edge, bye and that's number 10 or 11 behaviour.

Puja

broad took a bad knock on the head (2014?)- was averaging 28 at that point- and has clearly not fancied facing test pace since. Shame as he has batting talent, but 8 is at least 4 places too high

still has nearly 3500 runs and 540 wickets which is decent

Yeah Broad was a decent batter until that really nasty smack in the head. Occasionally puts some on the board now but really could have been a more consistent batsman but for that.

Puja wrote:

Stom wrote:I'm starting to wonder about Leach...I mean, I thought he was OKish before, but now I'm starting to think he's actually pretty poor.

Maybe I simply misremember, it was a long time ago, but the King of Spain was better than this, wasn't he?

But who the hell is there? Parkinson looked OKish first test.

I think Giles was quite badly underrated, tbh. Suffered by being in an era of truly great spin bowlers like Warne and Muralitharan, and the comparisons were never going to be kind, but he did a decent job with what he had, probably better than he deserved to based just on his natural talent. He was a hell of a lot better than any of our current spin options.

Maybe it's worthwhile accepting that we just don't have a spinner that's worth our time currently and look at another seamer? Or hells, get Moeen back - at least he'd reduce the tail and mostly hold down an end.

Puja

Moeen has said there were discussions with McCallum so wouldn't be too surprised if he comes back in.

I think Giles understood his role in the team. Keep an end quiet and let the pace lads loose at the other end then when it spins then have a rip. Leach just isn't very good (for this level).

Big D wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Puja wrote:Stuart Broad out for 9 after 2 boundaries. Wish I could say I was a prophet, but I feel it'd be cheating to claim that as a mystical prediction. He's just not a good enough batsman to play as high as number 8 - he might've been able to get there at one point, but at this stage in his career, he doesn't seem wiling to do anything other than swish, swish, edge, bye and that's number 10 or 11 behaviour.

Puja

broad took a bad knock on the head (2014?)- was averaging 28 at that point- and has clearly not fancied facing test pace since. Shame as he has batting talent, but 8 is at least 4 places too high

still has nearly 3500 runs and 540 wickets which is decent

Yeah Broad was a decent batter until that really nasty smack in the head. Occasionally puts some on the board now but really could have been a more consistent batsman but for that.

Yep its a shame- still a decent all round record ish, but he could have been averaging 30 with the bat and have 5000 runs and 500 wickets!

Big D wrote:

Puja wrote:

Stom wrote:I'm starting to wonder about Leach...I mean, I thought he was OKish before, but now I'm starting to think he's actually pretty poor.

Maybe I simply misremember, it was a long time ago, but the King of Spain was better than this, wasn't he?

But who the hell is there? Parkinson looked OKish first test.

I think Giles was quite badly underrated, tbh. Suffered by being in an era of truly great spin bowlers like Warne and Muralitharan, and the comparisons were never going to be kind, but he did a decent job with what he had, probably better than he deserved to based just on his natural talent. He was a hell of a lot better than any of our current spin options.

Maybe it's worthwhile accepting that we just don't have a spinner that's worth our time currently and look at another seamer? Or hells, get Moeen back - at least he'd reduce the tail and mostly hold down an end.

Puja

Moeen has said there were discussions with McCallum so wouldn't be too surprised if he comes back in.

I think Giles understood his role in the team. Keep an end quiet and let the pace lads loose at the other end then when it spins then have a rip. Leach just isn't very good (for this level).

agreed - leach tries hard, but his struggles at test level emphasise how low the standard in county cricket has become. See also opening batsmen!

great test

(who said we shouldnt have put them in??? Mitchell gets190 and 62 no, losing side and probs not motm).

great batting from yjb and stokes.

test cricket at its best

Great afternoons entertainment. This type of approach will help get people invested in test matches. Free entry was also a good move.

Well done to YJB, I'm a critic of his but well played.

England are still missing some pieces (3 injured quicks that any one of would make a difference, find a spinner and an opener) but with this approach they'll win more than they have.

Big D wrote:Great afternoons entertainment. This type of approach will help get people invested in test matches. Free entry was also a good move.

Well done to YJB, I'm a critic of his but well played.

If England are still missing some pieces (3 injured quicks that any one of would make a difference, find a spinner and an opener) but with this approach they'll win more than they have.

ditto on yjb, probably shows the benefit of definitively not being the keeper and a fixed batting spot.

nice interview from yjb. very measured and actually quite punchy in defending Root.

McCullum/Stokes - no messin.
Good toss to win..

Great test match and an outstanding win.