RugbyRebels

Every little helps; it helps to deflect from Mays argument that the people are in her side. If several million people sign a petition to withdraw article 50 that sends a big message to MPs that there is another option that has public support.

Sandydragon wrote:Every little helps; it helps to deflect from Mays argument that the people are in her side. If several million people sign a petition to withdraw article 50 that sends a big message to MPs that there is another option that has public support.

I repeat.... and do what, exactly? I genuinely don’t know what you are driving at? It can't be a surprise that there are millions who don't want to leave the EU? look at the dark bits on the graph, all heavy remain vote areas. Not saying its not a big statement, but not a surprising one.

Banquo wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Every little helps; it helps to deflect from Mays argument that the people are in her side. If several million people sign a petition to withdraw article 50 that sends a big message to MPs that there is another option that has public support.

I repeat.... and do what, exactly? I genuinely don’t know what you are driving at?

MPs seem to think that Brexit needs to happen because of the referendum. If Mays deal cannot pass then the only option is no deal Brexit which very few of them want. The only other viable alternative in the time scale is to withdraw Article 50. If there is demonstratable public support for that then it gives those who don’t want hard Brexit an argument to oppose the will of the people argument that brexiteers make.

In short this is a good way for the public to demonstrate their views without a referendum and it might give remainder MPs the opportunity to find some backbone.

I've signed the petition. Its a small gesture but if we see 2-3 million signatures I think it sends a message that not everyone is mad keen to throw ourselves off a cliff. I'm absolutely sick of the "will of the people" crap Brexiteer Mps keep trotting out. Its not my will, nor millions of other people.
The poll in itself isnt going to change events,. That is now down to Parliament. The Mps had a chance last week but bottled it. They've got one more throw of the dice with revoke a serious option.

Sandydragon wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Every little helps; it helps to deflect from Mays argument that the people are in her side. If several million people sign a petition to withdraw article 50 that sends a big message to MPs that there is another option that has public support.

I repeat.... and do what, exactly? I genuinely don’t know what you are driving at?

MPs seem to think that Brexit needs to happen because of the referendum. If Mays deal cannot pass then the only option is no deal Brexit which very few of them want. The only other viable alternative in the time scale is to withdraw Article 50. If there is demonstratable public support for that then it gives those who don’t want hard Brexit an argument to oppose the will of the people argument that brexiteers make.

In short this is a good way for the public to demonstrate their views without a referendum and it might give remainder MPs the opportunity to find some backbone.

As I said above (post edit soz), how is this a surprise- of course millions don't want to leave the EU, and as I noted, its the big remain areas that are 'turning out'. MPs like Heidi Allen already know this and have jumped ship.

If parliament turns round and revokes A50 we are sure in for interesting times; what a colossal waste of time and money the last 1000 days have been (which is true!).

Banquo wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Every little helps; it helps to deflect from Mays argument that the people are in her side. If several million people sign a petition to withdraw article 50 that sends a big message to MPs that there is another option that has public support.

I repeat.... and do what, exactly? I genuinely don’t know what you are driving at? It can't be a surprise that there are millions who don't want to leave the EU? look at the dark bits on the graph, all heavy remain vote areas. Not saying its not a big statement, but not a surprising one.

Which makes it sound like only remain areas are voting heavily.
The dark patches are patches because they keep changing the scale.
EVERY area is signing, heavily.
That remain areas are signing with greater numbers won't surprise anyone, and also doesn't minimise the impact of this either.
It is still unprecedented.

fivepointer wrote:I've signed the petition. Its a small gesture but if we see 2-3 million signatures I think it sends a message that not everyone is mad keen to throw ourselves off a cliff. I'm absolutely sick of the "will of the people" crap Brexiteer Mps keep trotting out. Its not my will, nor millions of other people.
The poll in itself isnt going to change events,. That is now down to Parliament. The Mps had a chance last week but bottled it. They've got one more throw of the dice with revoke a serious option.

as I said, how is that a surprise to anyone?

Parliament has bottled every chance, its true.

Which Tyler wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Every little helps; it helps to deflect from Mays argument that the people are in her side. If several million people sign a petition to withdraw article 50 that sends a big message to MPs that there is another option that has public support.

I repeat.... and do what, exactly? I genuinely don’t know what you are driving at? It can't be a surprise that there are millions who don't want to leave the EU? look at the dark bits on the graph, all heavy remain vote areas. Not saying its not a big statement, but not a surprising one.

Which makes it sound like only remain areas are voting heavily.
The dark patches are patches because they keep changing the scale.
EVERY area is signing, heavily.
That remain areas are signing with greater numbers won't surprise anyone, and also doesn't minimise the impact of this either.
It is still unprecedented.

and? Brexit is unprecedented.
I wasn't implying that it was only Remain areas, but that the weighting was unsurprising. I'd be genuinely surprised if anyone in parliament is surprised.....but worse, actually know what to do with it?

What's new is that people are getting this oissed off, and in these numbers.
If you doubt that, have a look at the other petitions there on Brexit; or see how it took off as a direct result of May's speech last night.
I repeat, in 28 days, it reached 80k. In 22 hours it's reached 1,200k

Which Tyler wrote:What's new is that people are getting this oissed off, and in these numbers.
If you doubt that, have a look at the other petitions there on Brexit; or see how it took off as a direct result of May's speech last night.
I repeat, in 28 days, it reached 80k. In 22 hours it's reached 1,200k

People have been pissed off for nearly 3 years, remember those mass marches. I'm glad you are all excited, but I genuinely don't know what it will turn into, hence asking the question.

People are pissed off with Brexit shock!

Jesus, it's going up at around 90,000 per hour...

3,000 every 2 minutes...

And no issues saying that you have to be excited or surprised.
However, the whole thing is surprising and unprecedented.

No-one expects anything much to happen as a result.
MAYBE one of two MPs might think twice before claiming they represent the will of the people. Maybe all it is is another piece of evidence that the country is nothing ifed behind May, regardless of her lies.

We k is more than we did yesterday about the numbers and strength of opinion. That is cold hard fact, whether it surprises you or not

Which Tyler wrote:And no issues saying that you have to be excited or surprised.
However, the whole thing is surprising and unprecedented.

No-one expects anything much to happen as a result.
MAYBE one of two MPs might think twice before claiming they represent the will of the people. Maybe all it is is another piece of evidence that the country is nothing ifed behind May, regardless of her lies.

We k is more than we did yesterday about the numbers and strength of opinion. That is cold hard fact, whether it surprises you or not

Maybe the uptake is a tad surprising, the depth of feeling is absolutely not (why is it a 'fact' that this number was not known yesterday- at least 17 million are known to be against leaving?) ....maybe folks had just got bored and May's statement and next Friday is a bucket of cold water and woken them up that we are in the last chance saloon. Interesting to see if anything changes on the back of it; it will take a ballsy group of MPs to stick revoke on the table.

If you don't think it's new, then please explain why none of the dozens of previous such petitions got any particular support, let alone record-breaking.

Banquo wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:And no issues saying that you have to be excited or surprised.
However, the whole thing is surprising and unprecedented.

No-one expects anything much to happen as a result.
MAYBE one of two MPs might think twice before claiming they represent the will of the people. Maybe all it is is another piece of evidence that the country is nothing ifed behind May, regardless of her lies.

We k is more than we did yesterday about the numbers and strength of opinion. That is cold hard fact, whether it surprises you or not

Maybe the uptake is a tad surprising, the depth of feeling is absolutely not (why is it a 'fact' that this number was not known yesterday- at least 17 million are known to be against leaving?) ....maybe folks had just got bored and May's statement and next Friday is a bucket of cold water and woken them up that we are in the last chance saloon. Interesting to see if anything changes on the back of it; it will take a ballsy group of MPs to stick revoke on the table.

Well, less than 17 million, surely... And I think that's the magic number. If this passes the leave votes from the ref., it will surely mean something...

1,269,501 passed

Which Tyler wrote:If you don't think it's new, then please explain why none of the dozens of previous such petitions got any particular support, let alone record-breaking.

I certainly don't think millions woke up this morning and said I've just decided I don't think we should leave the EU? As I said above, the immediacy of the actual leave date and May's bucket of cold water may have lead to them using this vehicle to protest (even I have signed up)....my contention is this scale of anger was already obvious to me- maybe because I know two very active campaigners? I'd be surprised if MPs did not know...or maybe I shpuldnt be.

Stom wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:And no issues saying that you have to be excited or surprised.
However, the whole thing is surprising and unprecedented.

No-one expects anything much to happen as a result.
MAYBE one of two MPs might think twice before claiming they represent the will of the people. Maybe all it is is another piece of evidence that the country is nothing ifed behind May, regardless of her lies.

We k is more than we did yesterday about the numbers and strength of opinion. That is cold hard fact, whether it surprises you or not

Maybe the uptake is a tad surprising, the depth of feeling is absolutely not (why is it a 'fact' that this number was not known yesterday- at least 17 million are known to be against leaving?) ....maybe folks had just got bored and May's statement and next Friday is a bucket of cold water and woken them up that we are in the last chance saloon. Interesting to see if anything changes on the back of it; it will take a ballsy group of MPs to stick revoke on the table.

Well, less than 17 million, surely... And I think that's the magic number. If this passes the leave votes from the ref., it will surely mean something...

I was projecting the remain vote from 16.1m, adding in the ones who have reached majoirty in the last 2 and lot years, plus those who actually might vote this time, plus a few switchers . And i agree.

Scot Nats (and other cots mps)tabling a revoke debate/vote next week. Someone had to do it- neither of the two main parties have the stones. Did it pre petition growth, so maybe the internet has been twitching with Remain campaigners, also the stop brexit march has set off. Lets see what Corbyn does.

Banquo wrote:. Lets see what Corbyn does.

Disemble if not just flat out lie

Banquo wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:If you don't think it's new, then please explain why none of the dozens of previous such petitions got any particular support, let alone record-breaking.

I certainly don't think millions woke up this morning and said I've just decided I don't think we should leave the EU? As I said above, the immediacy of the actual leave date and May's bucket of cold water may have lead to them using this vehicle to protest (even I have signed up)....my contention is this scale of anger was already obvious to me- maybe because I know two very active campaigners? I'd be surprised if MPs did not know...or maybe I shpuldnt be.

Absolutely nobody is saying that a tonne of people have changed their mind this morning.
I do think that last week's votes, and last night's speech has had a tonne of people saying "right, enough's enough, it's time that the rest ofnus are heard"
On both sides. Those threatening and attacking MPs, and those who have been completely ignored ores for the last 3 years, and those who were remain, accepted the result, waited for something tonactually be done, and have become increasingly disillusioned with then incompetence which came to Anuradha last night.
At 8.30pm
The precise time that petition took off.
In a way never seen before, and which you are unsurprised by, but is considered news by all the news sources and a huge surprise to nearly all political observers.

Digby wrote:

Banquo wrote:. Lets see what Corbyn does.

Disemble if not just flat out lie

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/politics ... 0321183808

Puja

Which Tyler wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:If you don't think it's new, then please explain why none of the dozens of previous such petitions got any particular support, let alone record-breaking.

I certainly don't think millions woke up this morning and said I've just decided I don't think we should leave the EU? As I said above, the immediacy of the actual leave date and May's bucket of cold water may have lead to them using this vehicle to protest (even I have signed up)....my contention is this scale of anger was already obvious to me- maybe because I know two very active campaigners? I'd be surprised if MPs did not know...or maybe I shpuldnt be.

Absolutely nobody is saying that a tonne of people have changed their mind this morning.
I do think that last week's votes, and last night's speech has had a tonne of people saying "right, enough's enough, it's time that the rest ofnus are heard"
On both sides. Those threatening and attacking MPs, and those who have been completely ignored ores for the last 3 years, and those who were remain, accepted the result, waited for something tonactually be done, and have become increasingly disillusioned with then incompetence which came to Anuradha last night.
At 8.30pm
The precise time that petition took off.
In a way never seen before, and which you are unsurprised by, but is considered news by all the news sources and a huge surprise to nearly all political observers.

No what I said was I wasn't surprised that the depth and scale of feeling existed, so I don't think that's a new fact. I did say this manifestation was a big statement. And I did say what I thought triggered it, which you agree with, And sort your spell checker please wtf is Anuradha

Banquo wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:

Banquo wrote:
I certainly don't think millions woke up this morning and said I've just decided I don't think we should leave the EU? As I said above, the immediacy of the actual leave date and May's bucket of cold water may have lead to them using this vehicle to protest (even I have signed up)....my contention is this scale of anger was already obvious to me- maybe because I know two very active campaigners? I'd be surprised if MPs did not know...or maybe I shpuldnt be.

Absolutely nobody is saying that a tonne of people have changed their mind this morning.
I do think that last week's votes, and last night's speech has had a tonne of people saying "right, enough's enough, it's time that the rest ofnus are heard"
On both sides. Those threatening and attacking MPs, and those who have been completely ignored ores for the last 3 years, and those who were remain, accepted the result, waited for something tonactually be done, and have become increasingly disillusioned with then incompetence which came to Anuradha last night.
At 8.30pm
The precise time that petition took off.
In a way never seen before, and which you are unsurprised by, but is considered news by all the news sources and a huge surprise to nearly all political observers.

No what I said was I wasn't surprised that the depth and scale of feeling existed, so I don't think that's a new fact. I did say this manifestation was a big statement. And I did say what I thought triggered it, which you agree with, And sort your spell checker please wtf is Anuradha

Anuradha is the new covfefe

Which Tyler wrote:Nothing "Arranged" about it - nor anything to do with Alistair Campbell.
It's just an online petition; albeit one hosted by the government and one that requires addressing in parliament.
It's also comfortably the biggest petition since the hosting site was set up; and absolutely thrashing the rival No Deal petition.
We're talking some serious numbers now, maybe even enough to get 1-2 MPs to consider their position; especially if the local figures show something interesting to them.

Trust me. People’s Vote are pushing this hard. I’ve seen the public comms on it.
It is unprecedented but only because these petitions have been such a flop since being introduced (not that I think they’re a bad idea). As Banquo points out, everything to do with Brexit is unprecedented, the density map looks almost identical to the referendum map and we already know that roughly 48% of the population don’t want to leave the EU.
The big news really should be that the Chief Whip is, supposedly. openly briefing against the PM since her speech. Her and her advisers really are clueless.