America

[Puja]

They would like their children to spend their time in school learning English, Math, and the basics rather than have pronoun confusion, affirmation of their childs dysphoria without parental notification or against the parents wishes, or teachers discussing their sexual orientation with 7 year olds. Parents want to have those conversations with their children when THEY see fit to do it, not any sooner, and to be able to deal with certain issues in a way they feel is best for their child. They would like for teachers and administrators to mind their own business when their son has an American flag sticker on his backpack instead of telling him its triggering for some students so he needs to take it off. They are fed up with activist teachers and their agendas.

Thats just some of the info Ive gathered from what Ive read/heard. This is a big reason why homeschooling and charter schools are so popular now.

Practically none of that stuff actually exists though - it's all scare stories. No child has ever been told they need to take an American flag sticker off their backpack because it's triggering. No school is eschewing English or Maths for "pronoun confusion". Yes, teachers may not hide away the fact that they have a husband/wife like they used to have to, but they're not going up to unsuspecting 7 year olds and saying, "I'm gay and you could be too if you work hard in school!" And, in case it's not abundantly obvious, no children are identifying as cats and being allowed to use a litter tray in schools, no matter what rumours Fox repeats.

They're not "the future that liberals want" - they're just scare stories, repeated and amplified by companies and figures who profit from people being scared.

The only thing in there which might be is "the future that liberals want" is "affirmation of a child's dysphoria without parental notification", but that's mostly because putting in place rules where teachers *have* to inform parents means that sometimes it's forcing the teacher to do something that they know may put the child in physical danger, so I'm leaning towards discretion about child protection over "parents have a right to know" there.

Puja

It has and does happen...its made news. American flags on things even like trucks in the school parking lot... one child had "Dont tread on me" on his backpack and it caused a stink... I dont think its happened hundreds of times but enough to make news and adds to the feeling that academia/education systems have become agenda driven instead of a safe place for diverse thought and ideas.

Sadly, "it's made news" does not necessarily equal "it actually happened", especially not if the news in question is Fox News. If you go and look at the details behind these "news" stories, it always ends up being, "There were reports of..." and "A post on Facebook said that..." and "People have heard it happening to their friends and their friends' friends; it's everywhere!" There is never actually any instance of the event in question, just a nice emotive story.

To quote Fox and OAN's unofficial motto, "Feelings don't care about facts."

Puja

[Mikey Brown]

Fucking hell. This page was a laugh.

[Eugene Wrayburn]

I wouldn't claim to know shit about American society or politics, but I saw this and wondered if it's possibly as accurate as anything else....

I always find it amazing that the left is attacked for incivility. Yes, there are absolutely obnoxious people on every fringe who drive people away, but it's not the left who use the epithet of "pedos" to describe marginalised groups and those who advocate for them - that's a mainstream right thing, endorsed and promoted by mainstream right leaders. Nor was it the "left" leader or "left" spokespeople who made constant streams of personal attacks about "DEI hire", "Slept her way to the top", "low IQ", etc.

The key bit of that diatribe is "They voted for the right to keep YOU out of decisions for their children." What decisions do they want to make that they feel the intolerant left would stop them from?

Puja

Donny's quoted text is accurate. The majority are fed up.

Frankly, most parents want their children to go to school to learn HOW to think (for themselves), instead of WHAT to think. They want their childten to be able to express their own thoughts and opinions... and to actually be allowed to have those thoughts/opinions/questions without being punished, shunned, or told they are wrong. They would like the opportunity to choose the public school their child goes to, whether it is in their district or not. They would like their children to spend their time in school learning English, Math, and the basics rather than have pronoun confusion, affirmation of their childs dysphoria without parental notification or against the parents wishes, or teachers discussing their sexual orientation with 7 year olds. Parents want to have those conversations with their children when THEY see fit to do it, not any sooner, and to be able to deal with certain issues in a way they feel is best for their child. They would like for teachers and administrators to mind their own business when their son has an American flag sticker on his backpack instead of telling him its triggering for some students so he needs to take it off. They are fed up with activist teachers and their agendas.

Thats just some of the info Ive gathered from what Ive read/heard. This is a big reason why homeschooling and charter schools are so popular now.

Who is it who's doing the book burnings again?

Literally every accusation against the democrats in that screed is truer of the republicans

[morepork]

They would like their children to spend their time in school learning English, Math, and the basics rather than have pronoun confusion, affirmation of their childs dysphoria without parental notification or against the parents wishes, or teachers discussing their sexual orientation with 7 year olds. Parents want to have those conversations with their children when THEY see fit to do it, not any sooner, and to be able to deal with certain issues in a way they feel is best for their child. They would like for teachers and administrators to mind their own business when their son has an American flag sticker on his backpack instead of telling him its triggering for some students so he needs to take it off. They are fed up with activist teachers and their agendas.

Thats just some of the info Ive gathered from what Ive read/heard. This is a big reason why homeschooling and charter schools are so popular now.

Practically none of that stuff actually exists though - it's all scare stories. No child has ever been told they need to take an American flag sticker off their backpack because it's triggering. No school is eschewing English or Maths for "pronoun confusion". Yes, teachers may not hide away the fact that they have a husband/wife like they used to have to, but they're not going up to unsuspecting 7 year olds and saying, "I'm gay and you could be too if you work hard in school!" And, in case it's not abundantly obvious, no children are identifying as cats and being allowed to use a litter tray in schools, no matter what rumours Fox repeats.

They're not "the future that liberals want" - they're just scare stories, repeated and amplified by companies and figures who profit from people being scared.

The only thing in there which might be is "the future that liberals want" is "affirmation of a child's dysphoria without parental notification", but that's mostly because putting in place rules where teachers *have* to inform parents means that sometimes it's forcing the teacher to do something that they know may put the child in physical danger, so I'm leaning towards discretion about child protection over "parents have a right to know" there.

Puja

It has and does happen...its made news. American flags on things even like trucks in the school parking lot... one child had "Dont tread on me" on his backpack and it caused a stink... I dont think its happened hundreds of times but enough to make news and adds to the feeling that academia/education systems have become agenda driven instead of a safe place for diverse thought and ideas.

This is fiction. A feeling is no substitute for data. "One child". You don't need protection from big government, you need basic instruction in the laws of probability. I teach undergrads and postgrads in basic molecular biology right up to the nuances of neurochemistry in neurodegenerative disease. At a public University. In no way shape or form have educating students on the laws of nature and how to observe and question the variances in these laws in a controlled empirical context been thwarted by the kind of attitude you claim exists. I've been held accountable for swearing in lectures and having a barely legible accent on occasion, but never have I used the platform to impose a doctrine of social conformity. Nor have any of my colleagues across the country, because we are fucking scientists. I participate every year in programs that give high school kids exposure to laboratory work in a (biologically) controlled environment (yes, biohazards are real) on top of obtaining funding from federal and industry sources for scientific initiatives that serve public health, employ talented local scientists, and have led to multiple initiatives that are manifest in controlled clinical trials for drugs that address real unmet public health needs that keep the population productive . The US has the best R&D environment on the planet that, with oversight from the FDA and NIH, ensures money is not wasted on the type of ideological vanity that you seem obsessed with. Who are you to judge this effort by us, who sweat blood to mentor the next generation of informed, motivated, and educated young people for the communal good? Take the option of charter or home schooling if you like, but keep your fingers out of the public purse if you choose to do so and front up to genuine peer reviewed scrutiny when you fall on your arse. I'm so sick of observing the Universe through the haze of this non-existent crisis.

[Mikey Brown]

All that and he doesn’t know how to form a paragraph.

Down with this sort of thing.

[Coco]

C'mon Coco, are you seriously claiming the republicans are the party of diverse thought and ideas? I don't remember what they used to stand for, but now, it's all about controlling the narrative, the courts and the vote. The dems have lost the plot, clearly, they lost. They have themselves to blame. My take, no one is listening to the people who are suffering, the "working class". Trump is pretending to, but he doesn't care about anyone or anything except himself and he's dumb as a post. It's about to become abundantly clear once he's forced to govern again, which I don't think is something he actually wants, but here we fucking are. 4 more years down the toilet, what a waste. Forget my political leanings, anyone but Trump on either side would have been better for the USA and the world.

No, what I am saying is the Republican party is the party pushing for the rights of parents to decide what is best for their own children.

[Coco]

Practically none of that stuff actually exists though - it's all scare stories. No child has ever been told they need to take an American flag sticker off their backpack because it's triggering. No school is eschewing English or Maths for "pronoun confusion". Yes, teachers may not hide away the fact that they have a husband/wife like they used to have to, but they're not going up to unsuspecting 7 year olds and saying, "I'm gay and you could be too if you work hard in school!" And, in case it's not abundantly obvious, no children are identifying as cats and being allowed to use a litter tray in schools, no matter what rumours Fox repeats.

They're not "the future that liberals want" - they're just scare stories, repeated and amplified by companies and figures who profit from people being scared.

The only thing in there which might be is "the future that liberals want" is "affirmation of a child's dysphoria without parental notification", but that's mostly because putting in place rules where teachers *have* to inform parents means that sometimes it's forcing the teacher to do something that they know may put the child in physical danger, so I'm leaning towards discretion about child protection over "parents have a right to know" there.

Puja

It has and does happen...its made news. American flags on things even like trucks in the school parking lot... one child had "Dont tread on me" on his backpack and it caused a stink... I dont think its happened hundreds of times but enough to make news and adds to the feeling that academia/education systems have become agenda driven instead of a safe place for diverse thought and ideas.

Sadly, "it's made news" does not necessarily equal "it actually happened", especially not if the news in question is Fox News. If you go and look at the details behind these "news" stories, it always ends up being, "There were reports of..." and "A post on Facebook said that..." and "People have heard it happening to their friends and their friends' friends; it's everywhere!" There is never actually any instance of the event in question, just a nice emotive story.

To quote Fox and OAN's unofficial motto, "Feelings don't care about facts."

Puja

Puja it has happened in a few states over the last 3-4 years. Tennessee (removal of 7 yr olds shirt for displaying AKA 1908), Colorado (Gadsden flag on backpack), Oklahoma (American flag removal from back of truck), Indiana (removal of American flag from vehicle), Virginia (removal of American flag from truck), Indiana (removal of shirt that said "I hope I dont get killed for being black today... ACLU even got involved)... Im sure theres a few more - definitely happened.

My point in saying these incidents have made news was simply to elaborate on the list of things parents are tired of... they saw it on the national news and it just added fuel to the already smoldering embers.

[Coco]

Rationalise it all you want, you’re a fascist.

lol...Awwwe, Bless your heart. If I thought for a moment that you knew what an actual fascist was, your opinion of me might have hurt my wittle feelers. The hypocricy is stunning.

BTW.. words like nazi, fascist, bigot, and even terf have lost their power and influence.

I don't give a fuck what your rationalisations are, you vote for fascist even once, you're a fascist. You've admitted to doing this on at least three occasions.

Any young women in your orbit? Daughters, nieces, etc? Go on, tell them why you voted for a rapist, against their right to bodily autonomy. Then, tell us all how that conversation went.

You are very much entitled to your opinion cashead, but Ive never asked for or needed your approval on my opinions or views. I only offered a confirmation to Donnys post and tried to explain the point puja was confused about.

I dont care if anyone here agrees or disagrees with me. I do try to answer questions if somebody is truly wanting to understand a different point of view though.

There are many women in my orbit... family and friends alike - most voted similarly but a few did not. The ones that did not vote for Trump roll their eyes at the body autonomy schtick when its brought up, as its not much of a blip on most peoples radar even though the establishment pushes it... its tiresome and they think too much emphasis was put in to that narrative when other things were more important to most women.

Apparently most women in the USA agreed.

[Donny osmond]

Absolutely loving all the non American men explaining to the American woman how and why she's wrong about American society and politics, then throwing in a few insults for good measure. This is what everyone loves about the Left.

[Puja]

It has and does happen...its made news. American flags on things even like trucks in the school parking lot... one child had "Dont tread on me" on his backpack and it caused a stink... I dont think its happened hundreds of times but enough to make news and adds to the feeling that academia/education systems have become agenda driven instead of a safe place for diverse thought and ideas.

Sadly, "it's made news" does not necessarily equal "it actually happened", especially not if the news in question is Fox News. If you go and look at the details behind these "news" stories, it always ends up being, "There were reports of..." and "A post on Facebook said that..." and "People have heard it happening to their friends and their friends' friends; it's everywhere!" There is never actually any instance of the event in question, just a nice emotive story.

To quote Fox and OAN's unofficial motto, "Feelings don't care about facts."

Puja

Puja it has happened in a few states over the last 3-4 years. Tennessee (removal of 7 yr olds shirt for displaying AKA 1908), Colorado (Gadsden flag on backpack), Oklahoma (American flag removal from back of truck), Indiana (removal of American flag from vehicle), Virginia (removal of American flag from truck), Indiana (removal of shirt that said "I hope I dont get killed for being black today... ACLU even got involved)... Im sure theres a few more - definitely happened.

My point in saying these incidents have made news was simply to elaborate on the list of things parents are tired of... they saw it on the national news and it just added fuel to the already smoldering embers.

Again, incidents reported on =!= incidents actually happening (or there not being significant context that completely changes the story beyond "You can't wear an American flag into school"). I will agree that "parents saw it on the news and it added fuel to their smouldering embers", but it's 99% scare stories, promoted by people who profit from people being scared about "the left and their activist teachers coming to take away American flags and teach your 5 year old about anal sex."

Puja

[Stom]

Absolutely loving all the non American men explaining to the American woman how and why she's wrong about American society and politics, then throwing in a few insults for good measure. This is what everyone loves about the Left.

Cashead is not the rest of us. And Coco has yet to react to Morepork, the only one with actual, real world experience in the "situations" she describes.

[Stom]

lol...Awwwe, Bless your heart. If I thought for a moment that you knew what an actual fascist was, your opinion of me might have hurt my wittle feelers. The hypocricy is stunning.

BTW.. words like nazi, fascist, bigot, and even terf have lost their power and influence.

I don't give a fuck what your rationalisations are, you vote for fascist even once, you're a fascist. You've admitted to doing this on at least three occasions.

Any young women in your orbit? Daughters, nieces, etc? Go on, tell them why you voted for a rapist, against their right to bodily autonomy. Then, tell us all how that conversation went.

You are very much entitled to your opinion cashead, but Ive never asked for or needed your approval on my opinions or views. I only offered a confirmation to Donnys post and tried to explain the point puja was confused about.

I dont care if anyone here agrees or disagrees with me. I do try to answer questions if somebody is truly wanting to understand a different point of view though.

There are many women in my orbit... family and friends alike - most voted similarly but a few did not. The ones that did not vote for Trump roll their eyes at the body autonomy schtick when its brought up, as its not much of a blip on most peoples radar even though the establishment pushes it... its tiresome and they think too much emphasis was put in to that narrative when other things were more important to most women.

Apparently most women in the USA agreed.

Just to clarify something, most women in the USA did NOT vote for Trump. Most voted for Harris. The largest voting group for Trump is white male...take that what you will.

Obviously there will be state by state differences, because the USA is basically a load of smaller countries put together.

But on the rest of what you've said so far:

Have you thought about checking the veracity of the information you've decided is fact? I know that this is something I like to do, and when I don't, I get shown up for it, and apologize. Like with the poor Algerian woman in the Olympic boxing, where I took the initial reports at face value and commented before doing my research. After I did my research, I apologized for my initial view, and then said my true thoughts on the issue.

For instance, how credible does it sound that a bumper sticker that was SIMPLY an American flag was forcibly removed? There's a chance it's not true, but what if it's partially true? And the bumper sticker in question was of the American flag with an offensive, racist, xenophobic, sexist, or other kind of phrase? If a news station reports that:

"A random man was stopped outside a school today and asked to remove his offensive bumper sticker"...the question would be: HOW IS THIS NEWS!!!

So the fact it's reported as just the flag, whether it is or is not wholly or partially true, gives the implication that this reporting is not in fact to bring you news, but to deepen the culture war taking place, and ensure that you feel like you need to vote in a certain way, which will promote certain interests...

I just can't help but look at, for instance, the Sharks on Shark Tank and feel like: Would I rather trust Mark Cuban with my life, money, and kids...or Kevin O'Leary...and I sure as hell wouldn't trust "Mr. Wonderful" with anything. And which one is the Trump fan?

[Mellsblue]

Absolutely loving all the non American men explaining to the American woman how and why she's wrong about American society and politics, then throwing in a few insults for good measure. This is what everyone loves about the Left.

Cashead is not the rest of us. And Coco has yet to react to Morepork, the only one with actual, real world experience in the "situations" she describes.

It’s anecdotal, not that I don’t believe MP, or Coco for that matter, in fact I have a lot of time for both of their opinions; however, as you say, ‘the USA is basically a load of smaller countries put together’ so what MP sees in Philly isn’t necessarily what happens in the rest of the country or indeed in the primary school down the road. Ditto Coco latching onto a handful of stories in a country of over 300mil though the idea that she has no ‘actual, real world experience’ is pretty laughable given here we are in Europe on a rugby chat board telling her what to think.
Not sure why I’m replying as this argument is sooo boring and miles from the really, really important stuff that will happen in the next four years, other than both things can be true, ie there will be institutions with their sole focus on academic rigour as there will be institutions with ideas on teaching on cultural issues. Both can be true at the same time and as much as we can have a go at people’s sources you can also look more critically at your own sources… In fact, from what I’ve read on the subject, just being told your sources aren’t believable and you’re thick for believing them (whilst simultaneously ignoring that your media of choice is probably almost as/just as/more skewed) makes someone less likely to change their mind.
My final thought, as alluded to previously, is I’ve no idea why Coco or MP give a flying f**k what people in a foreign country with no first hand experience of their world think about their political decisions.

[Stom]

Absolutely loving all the non American men explaining to the American woman how and why she's wrong about American society and politics, then throwing in a few insults for good measure. This is what everyone loves about the Left.

Cashead is not the rest of us. And Coco has yet to react to Morepork, the only one with actual, real world experience in the "situations" she describes.

It’s anecdotal, not that I don’t believe MP, or Coco for that matter, in fact I have a lot of time for both of their opinions; however, as you say, ‘the USA is basically a load of smaller countries put together’ so what MP sees in Philly isn’t necessarily what happens in the rest of the country or indeed in the primary school down the road. Ditto Coco latching onto a handful of stories in a country of over 300mil though the idea that she has no ‘actual, real world experience’ is pretty laughable given here we are in Europe on a rugby chat board telling her what to think.
Not sure why I’m replying as this argument is sooo boring and miles from the really, really important stuff that will happen in the next four years, other than both things can be true, ie there will be institutions with their sole focus on academic rigour as there will be institutions with ideas on teaching on cultural issues. Both can be true at the same time and as much as we can have a go at people’s sources you can also look more critically at your own sources… In fact, from what I’ve read on the subject, just being told your sources aren’t believable and you’re thick for believing them (whilst simultaneously ignoring that your media of choice is probably almost as/just as/more skewed) makes someone less likely to change their mind.
My final thought, as alluded to previously, is I’ve no idea why Coco or MP give a flying f**k what people in a foreign country with no first hand experience of their world think about their political decisions.

You're right, I was not clear enough. I meant the only other poster with experience.

And I agree with your sentiment. Completely. With so long spent here in Hungary, being able to take multiple sources for each piece of news has become vital, because they're just awful. There are about 4 English language news portals, and they're owned by either pro-government or anti-government organizations, not independent. And the Hungarian language media is mainly pro-government, and rarely independent. Which makes piecing together the "truth" difficult.

Especially when the reports are most likely (technically) true. (The ones Coco quotes).

[Son of Mathonwy]

Have you thought about checking the veracity of the information you've decided is fact? I know that this is something I like to do, and when I don't, I get shown up for it, and apologize.

Serious point - let's all try to live up to this.

Truth-check your own views.

[Banquo]

Have you thought about checking the veracity of the information you've decided is fact? I know that this is something I like to do, and when I don't, I get shown up for it, and apologize.

Serious point - let's all try to live up to this.

Truth-check your own views.

....and so say all of us...

[Mellsblue]

‘We now have a choice: rage at Trump supporters – or curiosity. We can spend the coming months in fruitless intellectual contortions about whether he meets the criteria for being a fascist, or we can properly understand what has just happened’


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... um=twitter

[Son of Mathonwy]

I wouldn't claim to know shit about American society or politics, but I saw this and wondered if it's possibly as accurate as anything else....

I always find it amazing that the left is attacked for incivility. Yes, there are absolutely obnoxious people on every fringe who drive people away, but it's not the left who use the epithet of "pedos" to describe marginalised groups and those who advocate for them - that's a mainstream right thing, endorsed and promoted by mainstream right leaders. Nor was it the "left" leader or "left" spokespeople who made constant streams of personal attacks about "DEI hire", "Slept her way to the top", "low IQ", etc.

The key bit of that diatribe is "They voted for the right to keep YOU out of decisions for their children." What decisions do they want to make that they feel the intolerant left would stop them from?

Puja

Donny's quoted text is accurate. The majority are fed up.

Frankly, most parents want their children to go to school to learn HOW to think (for themselves), instead of WHAT to think. They want their childten to be able to express their own thoughts and opinions... and to actually be allowed to have those thoughts/opinions/questions without being punished, shunned, or told they are wrong. They would like the opportunity to choose the public school their child goes to, whether it is in their district or not. They would like their children to spend their time in school learning English, Math, and the basics rather than have pronoun confusion, affirmation of their childs dysphoria without parental notification or against the parents wishes, or teachers discussing their sexual orientation with 7 year olds. Parents want to have those conversations with their children when THEY see fit to do it, not any sooner, and to be able to deal with certain issues in a way they feel is best for their child. They would like for teachers and administrators to mind their own business when their son has an American flag sticker on his backpack instead of telling him its triggering for some students so he needs to take it off. They are fed up with activist teachers and their agendas.

Thats just some of the info Ive gathered from what Ive read/heard. This is a big reason why homeschooling and charter schools are so popular now.

Out of interest . . .

What is your understanding of climate change? What (if anything) did you think of the presidential candidates' policies in that area?

Do you think the 2020 election was won by the Democrats through illegal methods? Do you think Trump pressured Republican election officials tin swing states to get him the votes he needed? What do you think happened on January 6th 2021 at the Capitol? Did any of these things affect your vote?

[Mellsblue]

Despite being a Lib Dem this bloke tends to be right on foreign policy issues.

https://cepa.org/article/trump-cards-a-survival-kit/

[Stom]

‘We now have a choice: rage at Trump supporters – or curiosity. We can spend the coming months in fruitless intellectual contortions about whether he meets the criteria for being a fascist, or we can properly understand what has just happened’


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... um=twitter

And while I may not agree completely with his takeaways…

100% onboard with the sentiment.

[Sandydragon]

‘We now have a choice: rage at Trump supporters – or curiosity. We can spend the coming months in fruitless intellectual contortions about whether he meets the criteria for being a fascist, or we can properly understand what has just happened’


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... um=twitter

And while I may not agree completely with his takeaways…

100% onboard with the sentiment.

Completely agree. The debate for how much of an authoritarian Trump may be is one for historians. The most urgent discussion must be on why the republicans won. It seems that this was as much if not more of a rejection of the past four years than it was a vote for Trump. You could argue that the republicans would have won more handsomely without Trump and his own personal baggage.

The dems lost a large swath of their traditional voters and need to think hard on who they represent. That doesn’t mean going full on socialist to a country that won’t want that. But many working class areas were very persuaded by the thought of a protectionist economy. The dems must find a way to improve employment and make people feel better off or this won’t be a single term Republican administration, but rather Trump handing over a baton to another Republican president.

[Mikey Brown]

Yeah it’s a shame how the blanket accusations of stupidity/fascism from all Trump voters seems to be so much of the focus in the backlash, when largely it seems to be people dismissing the culture war/personality drama in favour of “the economy”.

That’s not to say the attacks against Trump as a person aren’t valid, he is an absolute cunt, but a lot of people just don’t think that matters in comparison to the cost of day to day living.

The fact he’s managed to convince people he knows what he’s doing in terms of the economy is another matter though. I mean he still doesn’t seem to even understand what tariffs are or how they will really affect most people. So much of that discussion seems to completely ignore Covid and global inflation during sleepy Joe’s reign.

It’s hard to think of anybody that better embodies the spirit of outsourcing cheap, Chinese crap and sticking a US flag on it. That’s his entire ethos and identity. Did he make any headway at all on bringing manufacturing back to the US in his previous term?

I was listening to a conversation about the prospect of China getting hold of Taiwanese chip manufacturing, supplying virtually every big tech company in the world, and it doesn’t seem he has any grasp of that situation at all. He thinks ‘tariffs’ will hold them off.

I can’t really comment on the wokification of the school system - I like the concept of children being taught how to think rather than what, but I don’t know how that aligns with them not even learning of the existence of LGBTQ people. I’m sure there have been some instances of people overstepping, it depends which anecdotal evidence you take to heart or not, I guess.

For instance there have been a lot of responses to the suggestion of mass voluntary celibacy from women opposing Trump with the attitude of “as if you have a choice.” Is that meaningless social media drama or a pretty sickening indication of how a lot of men feel?

This is obviously not limited to the US at all, but there seems to be this complete inability for people to discern between an opinion/policy being bad and the person sharing that opinion just being a preachy, sanctimonious dickhead.

[Sandydragon]

With someone like Trump it’s easy to focus on his outsized and twatish personality, and ignore any policies. I think the presidential personality often over shines the party loyalty and policies. The Republicans won across the board so it does feel like it was a vote against democrats rather than people voting for Trump.

[Son of Mathonwy]

Yeah it’s a shame how the blanket accusations of stupidity/fascism from all Trump voters seems to be so much of the focus in the backlash, when largely it seems to be people dismissing the culture war/personality drama in favour of “the economy”.

That’s not to say the attacks against Trump as a person aren’t valid, he is an absolute cunt, but a lot of people just don’t think that matters in comparison to the cost of day to day living.

The fact he’s managed to convince people he knows what he’s doing in terms of the economy is another matter though. I mean he still doesn’t seem to even understand what tariffs are or how they will really affect most people. So much of that discussion seems to completely ignore Covid and global inflation during sleepy Joe’s reign.

It’s hard to think of anybody that better embodies the spirit of outsourcing cheap, Chinese crap and sticking a US flag on it. That’s his entire ethos and identity. Did he make any headway at all on bringing manufacturing back to the US in his previous term?

I was listening to a conversation about the prospect of China getting hold of Taiwanese chip manufacturing, supplying virtually every big tech company in the world, and it doesn’t seem he has any grasp of that situation at all. He thinks ‘tariffs’ will hold them off.

I can’t really comment on the wokification of the school system - I like the concept of children being taught how to think rather than what, but I don’t know how that aligns with them not even learning of the existence of LGBTQ people. I’m sure there have been some instances of people overstepping, it depends which anecdotal evidence you take to heart or not, I guess.

For instance there have been a lot of responses to the suggestion of mass voluntary celibacy from women opposing Trump with the attitude of “as if you have a choice.” Is that meaningless social media drama or a pretty sickening indication of how a lot of men feel?

This is obviously not limited to the US at all, but there seems to be this complete inability for people to discern between an opinion/policy being bad and the person sharing that opinion just being a preachy, sanctimonious dickhead.

Unfortunately for the Democrats, that is how they come across about 90% of the time. To be fair to him, Walz didn't.

[Sandydragon]

The dems aren’t talking the language of many of their traditional supporters. Trump has now nicked them.

They aren’t addressing the needs of those communities. Labour has much the same problem.