Cricket fred

[Digby]

Root needs runs quickly else the captaincy will be taken from him, no point having our best player not being our best player. That wouldn't mean he couldn't captain again down the line.

Players who can be sure of playing the next series based on the 3 tests so far would be Malan, Bairstow and Anderson, and the rest are yet to put their hand up, I suppose the fielding hasn't gone to pieces yet

[Banquo]

Shades of India - and the last Ashes trip - all over again.

There is an alarming lack of resilience and character about our cricket at times resulting in spectacularly heavy defeats.

Indeed.

[Banquo]

Root needs runs quickly else the captaincy will be taken from him, no point having our best player not being our best player. That wouldn't mean he couldn't captain again down the line.

Players who can be sure of playing the next series based on the 3 tests so far would be Malan, Bairstow and Anderson, and the rest are yet to put their hand up, I suppose the fielding hasn't gone to pieces yet

Think Root has a lot in the bank as a batsman, but if the team's behaviour and resilience is a reflection on his captaincy, then there is an issue for sure- whether it's leaking into his batting form is tricky to say tbh.

[Digby]

Root needs runs quickly else the captaincy will be taken from him, no point having our best player not being our best player. That wouldn't mean he couldn't captain again down the line.

Players who can be sure of playing the next series based on the 3 tests so far would be Malan, Bairstow and Anderson, and the rest are yet to put their hand up, I suppose the fielding hasn't gone to pieces yet

Think Root has a lot in the bank as a batsman, but if the team's behaviour and resilience is a reflection on his captaincy, then there is an issue for sure- whether it's leaking into his batting form is tricky to say tbh.

Root is hugely in credit, just he's done nothing this series. And whether he's a good captain or not I'd rather he was averaging 55+ and someone else was captain than have him down at 20 or worse

[Banquo]

Root needs runs quickly else the captaincy will be taken from him, no point having our best player not being our best player. That wouldn't mean he couldn't captain again down the line.

Players who can be sure of playing the next series based on the 3 tests so far would be Malan, Bairstow and Anderson, and the rest are yet to put their hand up, I suppose the fielding hasn't gone to pieces yet

Think Root has a lot in the bank as a batsman, but if the team's behaviour and resilience is a reflection on his captaincy, then there is an issue for sure- whether it's leaking into his batting form is tricky to say tbh.

Root is hugely in credit, just he's done nothing this series. And whether he's a good captain or not I'd rather he was averaging 55+ and someone else was captain than have him down at 20 or worse

well he was until this series (58), that's the shame of his senior guys letting him down....thats you Cook, Ali, and Broad!

[WaspInWales]

Why do we have so many problems batting and bowling on these pitches?

You would've thought the ECB would have enough resources to prepare the players for different climates. I'm not sure if this is feasible, but would it be possible to simulate these type of pitches artificially? Perhaps inside where the climate can be controlled.

If not, why are we not sending our players for intense training in Oz for a set period every year? Again, not sure if that is possible, but the ECB should have the money to hire pitches and utilise the knowledge of local groundsmen.

It's almost as if our best players have never played cricket before judging on their performances over there.

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[fivepointer]

Dont think its much to do with pitches. We just need to produce better cricketers who can buckle down when required and show a mixture of sound technique and mental toughness. The County Championship is not awash with consistent, high quality performers. There are a lot of very average players, even in division 1.
Our spin options are severely limited, we cant seem to produce genuinely quick bowlers who can stay fit and so many of our batsmen are woefully erratic. Wicket keeper- batsmen we have in abundance though!

[Banquo]

Dont think its much to do with pitches. We just need to produce better cricketers who can buckle down when required and show a mixture of sound technique and mental toughness. The County Championship is not awash with consistent, high quality performers. There are a lot of very average players, even in division 1.
Our spin options are severely limited, we cant seem to produce genuinely quick bowlers who can stay fit and so many of our batsmen are woefully erratic. Wicket keeper- batsmen we have in abundance though!

agreed, the lack of quality is pretty worrying, as you can't really see how it is going to get better- especially given the greater emphasis on shorter forms of the game- which unfortunately seems to favour dibbly dobbly bowling over strike bowlers, where defence has (Ha) limited value, and where classical technique is being supplanted by admittedly inventive new shot making. Test cricket will not remain popular here if our team continues to play like they have in Australia, and given that Test cricket is dying in many traditional hot beds, its possibly writing on the wall.....

That said, at home we keep on winning generally, so maybe there is something to build on.

[Mellsblue]

Paul Collingwood’s response. Seemingly ignorant of the fact they’re sent to county cricket to learn to play in Eng conditions, not because it’s a high standard of cricket.

[Mellsblue]

Yeh but, but, but my dad is bigger than your dad:

[Mellsblue]

Just in case you’re not depressed enough. The feckers even swing it more than we do.

[WaspInWales]

Dont think its much to do with pitches. We just need to produce better cricketers who can buckle down when required and show a mixture of sound technique and mental toughness. The County Championship is not awash with consistent, high quality performers. There are a lot of very average players, even in division 1.
Our spin options are severely limited, we cant seem to produce genuinely quick bowlers who can stay fit and so many of our batsmen are woefully erratic. Wicket keeper- batsmen we have in abundance though!

So, did you see this happening 5p?

I honestly thought we had a decent chance of drawing the series, or at worst winning one or two. Aussies were favourites, but I didn't think they were particularly outstanding before the series started.

They have looked absolutely world class at times against us.

[fivepointer]

I hoped we would be a bit more competitive. It did rely on our better players delivering and that hasnt happened. The Aussies were always going to have the edge in quick bowling and they do have the best batsman. What is disappointing is that we've had good sessions and periods where we've been in the game, only for us to fall away rather abjectly. There's nothing new in this: we have a bad habit of losing key moments and faltering in a pivotal session.
I'm not sure there is anyone on tour, or with the Lions, who would significantly improve our chances in the last 2 tests.
We might take a punt on Crane and possibly bring in Wood or Hales, but our resources are not extensive.

[Banquo]

I hoped we would be a bit more competitive. It did rely on our better players delivering and that hasnt happened. The Aussies were always going to have the edge in quick bowling and they do have the best batsman. What is disappointing is that we've had good sessions and periods where we've been in the game, only for us to fall away rather abjectly. There's nothing new in this: we have a bad habit of losing key moments and faltering in a pivotal session.
I'm not sure there is anyone on tour, or with the Lions, who would significantly improve our chances in the last 2 tests.
We might take a punt on Crane and possibly bring in Wood or Hales, but our resources are not extensive.

This. IMO we have missed a trick by not keeping Butler around the test scene, enabling Bairstow to bat higher. Stokes loss made a big difference in all three disciplines- he’s the sort of guy who stands up at the big moments- spectacular catch, or a big wicket, or a rapid 50. Fact is , key players have absolutely flopped, and some Aussies have stepped up.

[Mellsblue]

I expected the bowling figures, if with slightly better contributions from Ali and Broad. The batting was flipped on its head with all the newbies contributing and the experienced heads failing, save a handful of contributions from Bairstow and Root. If Cook, Root and Ali had been up to par we may at least drawn a match and made the other two tighter.

[Digby]

Just in case you’re not depressed enough. The feckers even swing it more than we do.

With a bit more pace they were happy to pitch it up more. Anderson and Broad have protected runs but at the cost of dropping the ball shorter to give less to drive, I suspect had we pitched it up more we would have swung it more, just we might have seen them score quicker rather than taken more wickets. I would though have liked to have pitched it up more and at least ask the question

[Banquo]

Just in case you’re not depressed enough. The feckers even swing it more than we do.

With a bit more pace they were happy to pitch it up more. Anderson and Broad have protected runs but at the cost of dropping the ball shorter to give less to drive, I suspect had we pitched it up more we would have swung it more, just we might have seen them score quicker rather than taken more wickets. I would though have liked to have pitched it up more and at least ask the question

Broad doesn't swing it anyway, but for sure would have been better pitching it up, though I suspect he's on his way out. Anderson has been decent, bar 1st spell at Adelaide- suspect this is his best tour here but haven't checked. In fact all of them bar Jimmy have been pretty pants tbh- Woakes has pitched it up and been caned....this is where your point about pace resonates, Woakes is a bit of a pie chucker on these wickets.

I haven't looked, but are the Aussies bowlers taller than ours (bar Broad), which obviously gives them more bounce too.

[Digby]

Just in case you’re not depressed enough. The feckers even swing it more than we do.

With a bit more pace they were happy to pitch it up more. Anderson and Broad have protected runs but at the cost of dropping the ball shorter to give less to drive, I suspect had we pitched it up more we would have swung it more, just we might have seen them score quicker rather than taken more wickets. I would though have liked to have pitched it up more and at least ask the question

Broad doesn't swing it anyway, but for sure would have been better pitching it up, though I suspect he's on his way out. Anderson has been decent, bar 1st spell at Adelaide- suspect this is his best tour here but haven't checked. In fact all of them bar Jimmy have been pretty pants tbh- Woakes has pitched it up and been caned....this is where your point about pace resonates, Woakes is a bit of a pie chucker on these wickets.

I haven't looked, but are the Aussies bowlers taller than ours (bar Broad), which obviously gives them more bounce too.

Take out the late spell in the day/night test under the lights and Anderson hasn't done much, well he's gone close to a few edges but so has Broad. The good news there for England though is I can't believe the TV pressure for day/night games will lessen even before it pushes an Aussie ashes series more into a possible European viewing slot, so the Aussies might be away to give away for free much of their advantage over England

[Banquo]

With a bit more pace they were happy to pitch it up more. Anderson and Broad have protected runs but at the cost of dropping the ball shorter to give less to drive, I suspect had we pitched it up more we would have swung it more, just we might have seen them score quicker rather than taken more wickets. I would though have liked to have pitched it up more and at least ask the question

Broad doesn't swing it anyway, but for sure would have been better pitching it up, though I suspect he's on his way out. Anderson has been decent, bar 1st spell at Adelaide- suspect this is his best tour here but haven't checked. In fact all of them bar Jimmy have been pretty pants tbh- Woakes has pitched it up and been caned....this is where your point about pace resonates, Woakes is a bit of a pie chucker on these wickets.

I haven't looked, but are the Aussies bowlers taller than ours (bar Broad), which obviously gives them more bounce too.

Take out the late spell in the day/night test under the lights and Anderson hasn't done much, well he's gone close to a few edges but so has Broad. The good news there for England though is I can't believe the TV pressure for day/night games will lessen even before it pushes an Aussie ashes series more into a possible European viewing slot, so the Aussies might be away to give away for free much of their advantage over England

If Anderson hasn’t done much, it says little for the other bowlers, which I suppose is the case. I think he’s been excellent tbh, giving he is carrying the attack and hardly a spring chicken...and with the Kookaburra to boot.

[Mellsblue]

The good news there for England though is I can't believe the TV pressure for day/night games will lessen even before it pushes an Aussie ashes series more into a possible European viewing slot, so the Aussies might be away to give away for free much of their advantage over England

I thought this, too, when trying to find some positives. It dawned on me when a lot of people were saying we were back in the series after the session under lights during we picked up a decent amount of wickets. At that point it was a negative, as I realised that the day/night match was the only time we would get conditions to suit our bowlers, but I tried to comfort myself that for future tours we could see two or three day/night matches.

[Digby]

Are their graphs available showing whee the Aussies scored runs? I ask as we again seemed to avoid having a 3rd man, even in order to have some not especially useful short mid-on and cover fielders

[Stom]

For me, Broad has been bowling like crap. And it's been going on for ages. He just always pulled a massive spell out of the air when he most needed it.

If Stokes comes back, I'd have him in for Broad. I think we need a change up.

[Mellsblue]

Starc ruled out of fourth test.

[Digby]

I don't quite follow why we announced days ahead of the test we might be playing 2 spinners, why tell the groundsman? A shame to see Starc out, he's been great to watch so far

[Digby]

I don't quite follow why we announced days ahead of the test we might be playing 2 spinners, why tell the groundsman? A shame to see Starc out, he's been great to watch so far

And the reason you'd tell them is it was a cunning trap for them to fall into, perhaps they'd even have a green pitch to counter act the spinners leaving the pitch suitable for a medium paced 4 man seam attack. It was odd given everyone out there thought playing 2 spinners so unlikely, but at least Moeen has looked class again